Hey Julia Woods
Join me, Julia Woods, a couples coach and wife of over 3 decades, as I share some of my client's stories and my own so that you can be encouraged, inspired, and gain new results in your marriage.
Hey Julia Woods
500% Increase in Meaningful Conversations
In this episode, Seth and Stacy share how their marriage transformed when they stopped debating surface issues and started exploring the beliefs driving their reactions. With simple shifts—like turning accusations into requests and regulating their bodies in real time—they rebuilt psychological safety and emotional intimacy. Their story shows that when couples name patterns with compassion, connection grows naturally.
💥💥Everything you need to grow the marriage you long for is waiting for you in the Marriage Growth Community:
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💥💥Everything you need to grow the marriage you long for is waiting for you in the Marriage Growth Community:
https://beautifuloutcome.com/mgc-one-time-offer
🎁 Free Gift for you! 100 Prompts and Ideas to Connect with your Spouse!
🎁 FREE GIFT: Turn Defensiveness into Connection! https://beautifuloutcome.com/e-guide
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Welcome to Hey Julia Woods Podcast. I'm your host, Julia Woods, founder of Beautiful Outcome, a coaching company focused on helping couples learn to see and understand each other, even in the most difficult conversations. On my podcast, I will share with you the real and raw of the messiness and amazingness of marriage. I'll share with you aspects of my relationship and the couples I coach in a way that you can see yourself and find the tools that you need to build the marriage you long for. Welcome to another episode of Hey Julia Woods. I am so excited, as usual, for this week's guest, which is Seth and Stacy from Richmond, Virginia. This couple has been together for 19 years, married for 12, have two little ones under the age of 10, and they have been coming to break through. I think this is their third year they've come. And they are getting incredible results that I am excited for them to tell you about them. That so I'll tell you the results in a minute. First, let me welcome Seth and Stacy. Hey guys. And um, let me just start with this random question that I've never asked. Did you guys listen to the podcast? Were you listeners to the podcast before you came to Breakthrough or not?
SPEAKER_01:I listened to I think a handful of episodes beforehand. All right. And now you're on the recording end.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I didn't know anything about Breakthrough until she's like, hey, we should go to this.
SPEAKER_00:Awesome. All right. So I want to share the results we've been talking about. We were talking pre-recording about some of the incredible results you're getting. And we were using the aid of Google to help us understand the percentage. So basically, what we discovered is you guys have had a 500% increase in your connecting with each other. And what that looks like is you were connecting on maybe on average once a week having a meaningful conversation. And that has shifted to now, on average, six days out of the week, you are having meaningful conversations. So tell us what is that like? Like what is this? How do you do this? What does it look like on a daily basis to have this space for to go from no rarely having a meaningful conversation to now almost daily having a meaningful conversation?
SPEAKER_05:I mean, previously we would get the kids to bed and then I would go, I don't know, read or watch a show or something, and he would stuff would go find something to work on in the garage or just literally in two completely separate areas. Um, we might connect over like scheduling what the kids have to do, what we have to do, what the week looks like. But um outside of that, not really talking about much. Um now we get the kids to bed and we usually both end up at the table talking about, I don't know, sometimes important things and sometimes just random thoughts that we weren't really talking about before.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I mean, it normally starts with just conversations around the day, how it went, what happened, you know, little details like that. And then the conversation just branches out into many different places.
SPEAKER_00:Mm-hmm. So what's a con what's an example of um like what you would talk about in the past that wasn't really meaningful, versus what is an example of a meaningful conversation now?
SPEAKER_02:Um I think I I mean it was literally like in passing, like if you think about like a coworker, you know, you're dropping coming by and saying, Hey, this report is due on the second and um I already took care of it, so don't worry about it. And then, you know, you separate to go do your thing. And then now it's um you know, there's just like that um I like I said, it starts with the small conversations and then it'll about you know how our day goes, this and that, and then it'll be like, oh, hey, I was I've been meaning to talk to you about, you know, this thing that has been bothering me, or that I feel like has been bothering you, you know. And then from there it depends on our emotional capacity on how far we take that conversation.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, or like even less serious, like, you know, what we're upset with each other about, but something like, oh, I read this article today, or I had this conversation with a friend and wanted to like get your opinion on it or, you know, share what I thought about it, which in the past would typically lead to conflict because we generally have different views on a lot of things, um, which it sometimes makes makes things hard. Um, but I think we've had an easier time having those conversations lately. Um, because we're not coming at it with a bunch of assumptions or already being mad about something. So feeling hurt in those other areas, I think makes us more open to sharing. I don't know where I was going with that more.
SPEAKER_02:I think it makes us less defensive.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah.
unknown:No.
SPEAKER_00:So this is massive, right? Like you don't a couple just doesn't magically defensiveness goes down, assumptions drop, curiosity increases, uh being able to, you know, be neutral with each other, uh, actually talking about tensions, talking about things that are bothering you, like that doesn't just magically happen. Right. So what happened? What shifted?
SPEAKER_05:I think we had a lot of great conversations at Breakthrough of like how do I phrase this?
SPEAKER_02:This lovely prompt that I kept helping.
SPEAKER_00:Oh what Seth just showed to the camera was the um conversation starters that are a part of Breakthrough. So each uh breakout session, they go out to have a breakthrough conversation, and it they're given prompts to help get the conversation started. So is that something you're still using in the day-to-day, Seth?
SPEAKER_02:Uh I wouldn't say day-to-day, but it definitely like is something that I would say that we've gone back to a few times to be like, all right, we're stuck. Like, what is something? And it's not necessarily we'll use it verbatim, but it'll like looking through it, it'll like spark something and be like, okay, here's this or that, or we can go from here this direction, and you know, yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Um, I was gonna say a lot of the conversations we had were like this uh when you are saying this to me or responding to me in this way, like this is how it comes across to me. This is the assumption that I'm making. Um, is this how you're intending it? Like, is this what you actually mean? Um I think a lot of the things were like, I feel like you don't actually care what I think about anything. Um, you know, or I don't know, you're saying this because you think you're better than me or you're you're smarter than me. And dropping those assumptions when we're coming to a conversation makes a big difference.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Assuming the best and remembering we're on the same team, I think has been a big thing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, like one event that sticks out in my brain recently is the other morning we got up and started with our normal morning routine, and I just felt like every thing that was said was very hostile and fun. I was like, hey, are you like like mad at me? Are you intending to be because you're very attacking in all the language you're using right now and your tone and whatnot? And she looked at me and she's like, No, I'm not. And I'm like, Well, did you just hear how you said that? Like so everything got quiet, and I was like, Okay, I'm gonna give you a minute to like process that. And I went on with getting the kids ready or whatever it was, and then came back, and she was just like, Yeah, I don't know. I'm I'm sorry, like just yeah. And then kind of diffused the rest of the day. When previously that would have been a nuclear episode on both of our part, and it would have defined the entire day of us not talking to each other.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. So a big situation for us right now is I am not working because of the government shutdown. And that's been really stressful, uh, both financially, and I'm not used to just having nothing to do right now. And so that's part of where that was coming from was just like I'm in my feelings a lot these days and stressed out and just I don't know what to do with myself. And a lot sometimes that comes out at him or the kids or whatever. And so he's been a lot more patient and being like, hey, this is, you know, I know you're upset, but like you can't talk to us like that, or um, but not assuming that I'm doing it just to be a jerk and understanding like where I'm kind of at right now.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Normally this would be, I think, a lot more contentious situation, a lot more arguing, and that's not really been the case.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I want to bring this, break this down for the listeners because what you're saying is really, really important. So knowing what happens at Breakthrough, what I'm hearing the two of you say is that breakthrough gave you a safe space to start bringing into the light or exposing the um negative beliefs you believed about yourself and about each other in a way that you could begin to discover something that was more true than what you had thought was true. Would is that sound like what you're saying or what you experienced?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I mean, our very first breakthrough, I think I said it in the the final testimony or whatever, was that like we got very little progress, our very first breakthrough, until Sunday afternoon. And that final little bit of breakthrough that Sunday afternoon, two years ago or however long it was, was defined the whole rest of the year until our next breakthrough, to the point where we had people in our lives saying, like, this is very you're very different, you know. What is what has happened? What have you what are you doing differently? Or, you know, did you marry someone different and forget to tell us? Yeah, the only definable thing would be it was breakthrough that I could come up with myself, and that it just I think that little bit changed like her mindset slightly, like it was a slight mindset change, and then carrying that through the year to then going into breakthrough this last year with kind of knowing the general process and then being able to take it a little deeper or well a lot deeper in some cases, and um go you know, it just like I don't know, the it was so much more than trying to say we just got so much more out of breakthrough this year, even though I feel like it was while you did things a little different, we were looking at it differently and understanding differently.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and just to explain a little bit more of that, so basically, every um at breakthrough, Saturday and Sunday are the days that you're going into your breakouts to have your breakout or breakthrough conversations. And what you're saying is that on the first year, you didn't actually experience a breakthrough until later in the day on Sunday. And that breakthrough actually made such a significant shift throughout the year that people outside your relationship were asking what had shifted. That is powerful. And that's the heart of the work that I do. That's why I'm so passionate about transformational work, is because transformation focuses on the belief, getting to the root of what is driving what you're thinking, what you're feeling, what you're doing. And so what I hear is on that at that Sunday, when you had that breakthrough, it was at a core level. It was a belief shift. What you're calling a mindset shift was a belief shift. That the beauty of a belief shift is you don't have to try and think different. You don't have to try and feel different, you don't have to try and do different. That automatically starts happening because you got to a root, you shifted at the root level. So would the two of you share a bit more about what that breakthrough was?
SPEAKER_02:Oh, what was that breakthrough? Two years ago or this year.
SPEAKER_00:Uh that if you can remember, like what was that breakthrough on that Sunday that made a shift for the whole year and then obviously kept growing, putting setting you up for a totally different way of being coming into this breakthrough. Um, but do you remember what the breakthrough was?
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, so that first year we went in talking about um like division of labor. Um I we never really figured things out after I had gone back to work after being a stay-at-home mom for a couple years, and I just felt like I was doing all the things and he was not doing all the things. I mean, he was working very hard, but like when it yeah, it was just it was a whole thing. Um, and I don't even know that that's what we ended up talking about, but um definitely wasn't. It wasn't. Um gosh, what a like I remember the conversation, but I don't remember what the exact breakthrough was. But we were talking about um oh, how I was scared to like bring anything up with him ever because I always just thought he was gonna leave. And um my mom had given like I'm gonna 30 second this best I can. My mom gave up custody of me when I was two, um, tried to give me up for adoption, ended up like my dad came and got me. And my dad had custody of me, but my grandparents raised me until I was 10 because my dad traveled around. Um, he was a pipeliner, so he was gone six to eight months of the year, and grandparents took care of me. And I forget what Seth's comment was. And if my dad listens to this, he's not gonna be happy because he is mad when I say this. But um he framed it as like, it makes sense that you're scared of people leaving because like, you know, your mom abandoned and then your dad abandoned you. And I was had never thought of it of like my dad abandoning me, right? Because he was working, he was trying to take care of me, but he also wasn't there. Um yeah. So we uh I was like, oh, that's I need to think on that. Um and so anyway, it just came back to this whole like fear of abandonment thing. And I had always put it on one person, but really it's kind of been a pattern in my life, and I was projecting that onto him.
SPEAKER_02:Um so hopefully.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Well, it makes so much sense that you turn the light on on a fear that you didn't even know you had. And a lot of a lot of spouses deal with the fear of abandonment based on, regardless of whether their parents were intentionally abandoning them or not. The reality is, as parents, sometimes in our life, in our day-to-day life, we can't be there with our children when they're suffering, when they're hurt, when they're sad. And so it does feel like abandonment to the child. And that is that makes a lot of sense that that created a significant shift. Because what I hear happened, Seth, is you experienced empathy. You started seeing that what you were experiencing in her really wasn't about you. And for you, Stacy, it sounds like you began to realize oh, the abandonment's not happening in the present. But if I believe it is happening in the present, I will actually make it happen in the present and make this conversation feel like he's abandoning me when actually he's sitting right here.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. And I mean, I kept becoming a thing of like, he would ask, you know, clearly something's bothering you. And I'd be like, no, I'm fine. Because I was like, well, if I discuss the hard thing, then he's gonna not receive that well and peace out and believe, yeah. So um, and then you know, I think eventually we came to figuring out something with the the division of labor stuff. But um, I think we experienced that a little bit this year too. You know, we came to talk about one thing, but there were other things that needed to be discussed to really get to what we came there to talk about.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah. Yeah, just so for the listeners to understand, when you come to breakthrough, you come with a specific topic that you want to break through to deeper levels of connection, possibility. And often what happens most often is couples come in with a conversation they think they want to break through and they know what's needed in order to break through the conversation. And then as we get going, they're like, oh, this is far deeper than we had any idea. And when you get to the root, then all of a sudden the tension, the topic you wanted to break through kind of sorts itself out pretty easily because you got through the roadblock you didn't even know was there. Would you say that's true for you guys?
SPEAKER_05:And it gives you another level of understanding. Like there were, I think Seth had his moment this year. And he was like, wait, no, you're supposed to be the emotional one that's falling apart.
SPEAKER_02:Um I noticed a breakthrough in one of the things when we stood up, I was like, I don't know why I'm emotional. And later that night we were talking, I just went out into Airbnb we were staying at and sat in the, you know, it was this huge hill with a great view, and I just sat there and like thought through it for a while and had like a complete emotional breakdown by myself to figure out some stuff. And then we talked about it, and it's been you know, one of the things I noticed that we we had talked about a breakthrough through some stuff. I think you talk about it on some of your podcasts, is like how you hold tensions in certain parts of your body, and the next day my lower back did not hurt the same way. And I was like, Oh I'm starting to put two and two together here.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yes, yeah, and you called it an emotional breakdown. It sounds like an emotional breakthrough.
SPEAKER_03:Well, both.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Things you were holding on to that needed to be moved through. That's powerful. So as you guys are experiencing this uh, you know, consistent, meaningful conversation. Is this feel brand new? Does this feel like what it was like in the beginning of your relationship? Like, give us some context for is this something that's returned that was what was there, or is this completely new?
SPEAKER_02:Uh no, it goes back to our when we first got together, at least for me, when we first got together, we talk about we used to a friend of mine had would moved into a house and we had to repaint the room and we repainted it, shut the door, and then sat in it and talked for like six hours. So we got like high as a kite on paint fumes. You know, just talked about I don't even know what everything.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. That's what has always been so interesting is you know, we were I was 16 when we started dating and we were really good friends before that. And I think that has been something that we've always had to fall back on, even when we're super mad at each other. But yeah, we would stay up till two, three o'clock in the morning when we were having these like group sleepovers and having all these great conversations, and then somewhere along the way it was like it's too dangerous to have this conversation now because we've have too much invested. So yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Let's talk about that, right? So what I hear you saying is the friendship is returning, the ability to be friends is returning. Where did it go? What describe more about that danger that brought you to tiptoe around meaningful conversations or avoid them altogether?
SPEAKER_02:I think sorry, I want to take part of this. I think part of it is that our I'll start with our fight or flight reactions are very different. Like, and like when we get into a conflict, my goal is to get to the end of the conflict as quickly as possible. So however large of an emotional, like passionate display of you know, whatever it takes to get there, passionate, he says is you know, it's all like perfectly acceptable and it's the means to the end, right? And in me doing that and expressing that, it clicked her fight or flight to shut down. And like I can visibly see it when it happens, and then it just I'm just like, okay, well, we're at the end because this isn't going anywhere else. So I'm gonna, you know, word vomit as loud as I can, as quickly as I can, to get this done, and then we'll storm off to our corners and wait three weeks and try to talk about it again.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Um like the the friendship stuff though. I don't know that that ever really went anywhere. I think that's probably what has saved us in a lot of times is we have gotten really good at compartmentalizing. Like I'm really angry with you right now, but I can still be in the same room with you. Um but to that point, like we weren't having fun together, which you know is important. Yeah. And I think and I don't know, more playful.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. There was two significant things you described earlier in in our pre-conversation that you were noticing was different. And one was that you said we're less defensive overall when being called out. Yeah. Um, tell us more about that.
SPEAKER_01:What does that mean?
SPEAKER_05:Um, I mean, there have been times where I'm trying to think, like the way that I'll say something or like the tone or how I phrased something, he's like, Did you hear the way that you just said that to me? Like that was not okay. Um and I'll like, but previously I would have been like, Well, you talk to me like this all the time, and so I'm gonna do it. Um, and I think I've and I I don't want to pretend like everything's sunshine and rainbows and perfect because we both still, but um I think now I'm more apt to be like, you're right, I could have I could have phrased that better, or like, let me try that again.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and I think too, some of the times where we've had our larger differences recently. It's we've gotten to a point to go back and be like, okay, where where did this shift? Like what what happened in the conversation? At what point did it go from being, you know, uh a a meaningful conversation to us like yelling at each other and trying to figure out you know what what caused that. You know, sometimes it's you know, like I will hear things, you know, that I want to hear. My my victim mentality, right?
SPEAKER_05:It's like, okay, well, I'm ready to be a victim now, so please give me some ammunition to make there was a couple weeks ago, I can't remember what we were talking about, but things got a little heated and I kind I did shut down and he sat at the table with me for a couple minutes, and then he just like got up and took out the trash. And I was like, Okay. Um, and he came back a couple minutes later and was like, I just said all this stuff to you and you like didn't even acknowledge it. Can we actually talk about it? Like, can we keep going? Um and normally he would have just been like, Okay, you're clearly not talking about this anymore. I'm just done with it. Um but he came back and kind of like made an effort to disarm me in a way of like, I'm not trying to be confrontational. Like, can we just talk? Um and I think we I think I don't remember what it was, so I'm gonna assume that we got through it.
SPEAKER_00:Well, and there's this significant distinction in what you're describing, Stacey, is that in the past, Seth, it sounds like you would have made a statement. Well, clearly you're not gonna talk to me, so we're done. That that's more my voice of how I would be with Jeff. Um it's a statement, right? It's a judgment, it's an assumption, it's an assessment. There's no curiosity to it, whatever. And the one that Stacy just revealed is you actually said, you shared what your frustration was. I just shared all these things with you, and you didn't respond. Would you be willing to have a conversation with me? Right? It's a question, it's a it's a it's a request. It seems obvious from the body language in those situations when our spouse is shut down that they're done with the conversation. But instead, you chose to get off of what seemed obvious and actually make a request. And that is significant in being able to move forward in a conversation when shutdown happens.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I mean, and he came back with such like a calm demeanor. And I think that made the big difference is because when his voice escalates, I'm like done. I'm trying to not be like that anymore. But um, yeah, he's also more susceptible or more accepting when I'm like, hey, that was like I need you to lower it.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like my my my voice and whatnot as I get excited in any way, shape, or form just elevates.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. You know, and it's not that he's even like yelling at me or anything. It's just like it's escalated. And I don't take that well.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Yeah, because you know, 90% of communication is nonverbal. So that's what I hear you describing, Stacey. And and that's powerful, Seth, that you gave yourself the space. I'm just going to one of the things we talk a lot about in breakthrough is if you shift your physical state, you'll shift your inner state. And so that's what I hear you chose in just getting up, taking care of something, the trash in this situation. And it's what what was going through your mind when you were doing that? Like what how were you? I'm imagining you were coaching yourself to be able to come back and respond the way you responded. So, what was that mental gymnastics you were doing in in your head in that process?
SPEAKER_02:Um, I think it was I need to do like we've got to a point we get to on a regular basis. And you know, the definition of insanity is continue to do the same thing and expect a different result. And so I was like, okay, let's try something different. And I was like, I'm gonna, you know, take the trash out because I know it needs to be done, and then maybe, you know, she'll see that I'm taking the trash out, which is always a point of contention.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, working, working to get some uh at a boy points, huh?
SPEAKER_02:Maybe it'll like get her thinking differently or something. And so I took it out. I think I stood outside for a minute and and debated with myself, like, do I go back in or do I just leave it alone? Like, what do I do? And I was like, well, normally I'd just like go down there, so let's do the opposite of that and go back and see you know what happens. And then I think I took like five or six very deep breaths to like lower my heart rate. Yeah, I was like, okay, I'm gonna I think I said I'm gonna word bomb it a second to like try to get this like point across that like I am I'm not intending this to be a conflict. I am asking like for your feedback and I don't know like how else to do that like in a less confronting way.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's huge because the theme of breakthrough this year was I'm dying um I am lying for me or dying for you. And that's what I hear in what you said, Seth. You were you were listening to the lie of this is not gonna go anywhere. Uh it's not even worth having a conversation. Let me just keep listening to that lie and go off and do my thing. But instead, you chose to die to yourself by being willing to be vulnerable, being willing to go again, being willing to risk that something new might open up in the conversation. And that's that's the beauty of what happens when we're willing to die to our survival system. Like you said, you had to take the cleansing breath, you had to get reconnected to your body and get realigned with who you're committed to be and what you long for in the relationship and take a risk. And you it wound up creating what you longed for.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:I wish I could remember what we talked about because we had a really good conversation. But I have no recollection.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, I know on the general basis, it was like I'm saying things to you and you're not like you're not not responding, you're not even validating that I said anything.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And that was that had been like, I vaguely remember it being like, that had been something I think I had been trying to communicate throughout the week with in different littler situations. And I think finally in that situation, I was like able to actually like put it into words, like what my frustration was.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So I think we went back and had, I think we had more than one conversation in that conversation.
SPEAKER_00:But yeah. Yeah, because what we're at the heart of it, what we're longing for in a conversation is really to be acknowledged for what we're experiencing to be acknowledged, for it to be recognized and you know, considered, and then for there to be some levels of empathy, even if we don't agree with what our spouse is experiencing, as a human perspective, if we can hear them, we can recognize that that would be very painful to go through as a human being. And that often is what we most need. We just want to what we said to be acknowledged, it to be recognized, and to be empathized with. So can you tell us more about those results?
SPEAKER_02:Um, I think some of it, I think you made the comment to me at breakthrough of I can't remember exactly how you put it, but basically it was like, you know, you don't know if you like something if you've never had it. So if you've never had Korean barbecue, you don't know that you love it. And so I was I've just been taking the stance of, okay, I know that these other parts of the emotional connection are very important to Stacey. So let's spend some more time in that and I guess see see what happens. You know, and the um I guess in doing that to your point, like I have enjoyed them more than I expected to.
SPEAKER_05:I think something I appreciated was you pointing out to him, like you know, he used to always say, like, sex is how I feel connected, like any connection to you.
SPEAKER_02:And I Well, not any connection, well, yeah, more connection.
SPEAKER_05:Okay. Um, I think you said, like, well, perhaps that's just the only way that you've been told that you feel that connection. And I think, you know, his family history, my family history, like societally, like that's what kind of the message that men get, right? Like, you don't have emotions kind of thing. And so having the conversations that we've had and on all the different things, um I think he's been like, oh, I actually, I actually do enjoy this and it's important.
SPEAKER_00:So yes. Yeah. Yeah. I believe that the union of marriage is really um very powerful. And what you know, we think that, oh, women need emotional connection and men need physical connection. I don't believe that's true. I believe we need both. And it was just divided between male and female, so that as we pursue meeting each other's needs, we actually get needs met we didn't realize we actually have. And they get met in a much more powerful way because those two, when they're those two are both being met, both are much better. Emotional intimacy is much better when the physical intimacy is is beautiful, and the physical intimacy is much more beautiful when the emotional intimacy is there.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:And I mean, for me, it's always been trying to phrase this in a way that doesn't sound terrible. Um, like a like from a safety aspect and like safe to be vulnerable. Um I have some sexual trauma in my past. And so I was never going to like just do something because I'm supposed to do something.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Um, I had done that in years past, and the dissociation is not good for anybody. Yes. Um and so I think just your rephrasing of that kind of helped him understand that better too. So that was very helpful.
SPEAKER_00:Beautiful. It's really one of those things, what comes first, the chicken or the egg? And the reality is usually if the sex life is uh struggling or not what you're longing for, it's usually because the emotional intimacy is not what's needed in order to create what you long for there. So powerful. And what incredible results, both for each of you individually and for your children to get to experience. And obviously it's it's making such an impact that your friends and family are noticing. Wait, something's different with you guys. And so that's that's ultimately the beauty of love, right? That's what that's what I'm passionate about is helping couples experience the deepest levels of love possible in their marriage because it's a community ripple effect. It affects everybody in the wake of your lives, the more deeply you're you love each other. So very grateful for the two of you and grateful for your willingness to share with us. Any last thoughts that you feel, man, I wish that someone had told me this um before we started experiencing these breakthroughs.
SPEAKER_05:Um I mean, just going to breakthrough and the other resources that you have available. Um, just quick sidebar. When we got married, we both had terrible examples for marriage and decided that we wanted to do counseling just kind of from the get-go. Um, and nobody ever really knew what to do with us because we weren't on the edge of divorce. Um, we were like, we just want to know how to not get to that place where we hate each other. Um and we went on and off for a little while, took a long break, went back, but our last one was like 2019, because it was right before COVID. So early 2020, actually. And we had just found out that we were pregnant with our daughter and our therapists didn't know that. But we I forget what we were even arguing about there, but it was not that big of a deal. And she was like, Well, this is your last like session that we have scheduled. If you want to continue to work together, like I'm gonna do this stuff. Um, she said, But honestly, I think you guys just don't need to be married anymore. I don't think you care about each other enough. And this was a Christian counselor. She was like Gottman certified and all that. And we, you know, thought we had somebody good.
SPEAKER_02:And I remember leaving recommended to us too. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:People, I remember leaving and looking at each other in that parking lot. Like, what?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I remember one of us asked, We're like, Did what what did you just hear in?
SPEAKER_05:And it was something stupid. We were we're both just stubborn and we were digging our heels in, and neither one of us wanted to go. And that was where she went with that. And so, you know, to go to breakthrough last year, we really didn't like each other when we went last year. Well, and it was too hold on a second, it was really difficult. Um, why is it so much easier? And it's like, because we had, you know, it wasn't like the year before was a perfect year between the two, but um just having the tools to move through things was really helpful. And, you know, you giving us the tools to do the work uh and know like we're not, you know, beyond help or anything like that, which I think is what she made us feel like like, are we really that bad?
SPEAKER_02:Well, and then we went to a couple other, you know, marriage self-help seminar type things that you signed us up for. Um never really got anything out of any of them. And so coming into breakthrough, my thought was like, okay, well, here we go again, you know, one more thing. I was like, at least we're still trying, was my thought. Yeah. Um so so, and then I guess my thing would be is the like I said, like we struggled our first breakthrough and whatnot, and you know, seen other people do that. And I would encourage people, especially if they do go, to go back at least a second time, because it's a very different experience for you.
SPEAKER_05:I think that the I just lost my train of thought. Being in a room with other people and hearing like, oh, they are having the exact same problems that we are makes you feel less crazy.
SPEAKER_02:Well, even if they're wording it the exact same way you do in your brain.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, you're like, oh, I'm not as dysfunctional as I thought we were.
SPEAKER_02:Sometimes people get up and say things and you're like, Yeah, I kind of agree that, and then you work through it and you're like, oh, maybe I am apathetic. I didn't think I was. You know, yeah. So there's there's a lot of processing that you can do watching other people the exact same conversations that you're wanting to have.
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Sorry, Stacey, what'd you say? It's not as scary as I thought it was. Yeah. And I know as uh, you know, I'm a couple's coach and a trainer. And what I can do as a trainer in a room with other couples who are all committed to the same thing of breaking through a conversation to deeper love and connection, I can't do that in a counseling appointment, or I can't do that in a coaching appointment because most of what we need to see in ourselves, we we see it in other people, but it's way harder to see it in ourselves until we can see it in someone else. And that's the beauty of what happens at breakthrough, as well as it's just this place where you pull away from the busyness of life and submerge yourself in finding a way to create new possibility and connection with each other in a specific topic. And that that is just a rare opportunity. So I am grateful that it's connecting for you. And I absolutely see the level of care that the two of you have for each other. And I'm excited you decided what that counselor said was not accurate in any way, and you kept pursuing uh deeper love and connection with each other.
SPEAKER_02:And we're very thankful that you do what you do, or else we probably not be where we're at right now.
SPEAKER_00:Accurate. Well, thank you guys so much for joining us. I am so grateful and excited for everyone to hear these powerful results. So thank you so much.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you. Thank you.
SPEAKER_00:I want to talk to you about something super exciting. It's a game changer, really. To have the relationship you long for, you must take responsibility for yourself and who you are being moment by moment. It's not about what your spouse needs to change, it's about you taking control of the only thing you can control, which is you. That's the truth that nobody's talking about when they talk about marriage. But I am inside the marriage growth community where I will help you take responsibility for your ability to lead conversations with your spouse, to love and connection, so you can have the marriage you dreamed of when you first fell in love. At the very first link in the show notes, you can grab my marriage growth community, and that's really going to help. I know that because it's based on the same principles I've used to coach this couple and hundreds of other couples to marriage success over the last nine years. So grab marriage growth community at the top of the show notes.